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New tapes. “To make it look like it was implemented in a way that was not a promotion of Solidarity Poland”

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“The fundamental thing is that it should look like it was actually implemented in a way that was not a promotion of anyone from Solidarna Polska… In what form you do it, that's it…” – among others, such words are uttered by Marcin Romanowski in the next ones revealed on TVN24 tapes. In a special edition of “Black and White”, we showed new materials, and the recordings were commented on by TVN24 and tvn24.pl journalists who have been dealing with the Justice Fund case for a long time.

During a special edition of the “Black and white” program on TVN24, we published new tapes regarding the Justice Fund scandal. The interview includes former Deputy Minister of Justice Marcin Romanowski, Dariusz Matecki, Mateusz Wagemann and Tomasz Mraz.

Marcin Romanowski: Second thing, to somehow explain Racibórz and Rybnik, it would be good for you to quickly do a similar action in a place where it won't be like that for a change… (laughter)

Dariusz Matecki: Throw it all into one circle?

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Mateusz Wagemann: Wouldn't it make sense to do it where there are portals? Only in these areas?

Tomasz Mraz: Then there will be an attack that you have finally started doing what you should be doing.

Marcin Romanowski: Approx.

Tomasz Mraz: At least that's how we stick to this narrative, (unintelligible) in order to increase our reach.

Mateusz Wagemann: So spread it to other parts of Poland?

Dariusz Matecki: But in one or in several?

Marcin Romanowski: You know what, how was it done? No, several. (Unintelligible)

Marcin Romanowski: Listen, once again: the fundamental thing is that it should look like it was actually implemented in a way that was not a promotion of anyone from Solidarna Polska… In what form you will do it, that's it… the important thing is that the effect is as follows, to do something in Słupsk , in Zielona Góra.

Unidentified voice: …Podlasie.

Marcin Romanowski: and in Suwałki.

How did Sovereign Poland increase the party's reach? New tapesTVN24

“As if they had their own money”

Nagania was commented on by guests invited to the studio – “Czarno na white” journalists Artur Warcholiński, Dariusz Kubik and Rafał Stangreciak and tvn24.pl journalists Sebastian Klauziński and Robert Zieliński.

– In these recordings, they talk as if they had their own money. It's as if they just put a suitcase of money on the table, their money, and spread it around: we'll give this much here, we'll give this much here, we'll give this much here. But it was all of our money, emphasized Stangreciak.

"As if they had their own money".  Comments on new recordings in the Justice Fund scandal

“As if they had their own money.” Comments on new recordings in the Justice Fund scandalTVN24

Klauziński said that “we kind of forget” that the Justice Fund “was created to support crime victims and organizations.” – So we imagine that behind the competitions, how to divide the money, there is a committee of experts, advisory bodies, people who know about this – he continued. – And that's exactly what it's like: gentlemen just sit at the table and say: give this much here, maybe that much here, and here we'll come up with enough to give – he pointed out.

Warcholiński, however, said that “this fragment of the conversation comes from a meeting that was already published on the TVN24 portal, in which – apart from the then deputy minister Romanowski – Dariusz Matecki, the head of Solidarna Polska, now Sovereign Poland, in Western Pomerania; Mateusz Wagemann, then deputy voivode on behalf of Solidarna Polska at that time, and of course Tomasz Mraz, an official from the Justice Fund Department. In his opinion, the words used in the recording – “to make it look like this is not a promotion of Solidarity Poland politicians” – are “devastating”

READ MORE: Matecki comes to Romanowski. “It looks very bad, gentlemen.”

Warcholiński o "shocking" words on the leaked recordings

Warcholiński about the “shocking” words in the leaked recordingsTVN24

Fragment of the revealed tapesTVN24

“They are used to act as a screen to siphon off money”

Zieliński talked more about the mechanism of operation of the Justice Fund itself. – An additional, and, I think, very important role of Marcin Romanowski was to gather, search for, educate young law school graduates, gather them around the Ministry of Justice, around Solidarna Poland – later Sovereign Poland – and use these young people to create various foundations in various parts of the country where money from the Justice Fund went – he explained. – While working on one of such stories – the Life Foundation in Łódź – I was amazed and a bit devastated that Marcin Romanowski, deputy minister of justice, managed to find talented law graduates who had their whole future ahead of them to serve as a screen – said the journalist. – I had the impression that these young people were simply serving as a screen to siphon money from the Justice Fund – he added.

Robert Zieliński: these young people are used to act as a screen to siphon off money

Robert Zieliński: these young people are used to act as a screen to siphon off moneyTVN24

Main photo source: Albert Zawada/PAP



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